The European Commissioner for Enlargement, Olli Rehn, today presented Iceland’s Prime Minister Johanna Sigurdardottir with a questionnaire assessing the country’s readiness to fulfil EU membership obligations. The responses provided by the Icelandic authorities will serve as a basis for the Commission to prepare an opinion on Iceland’s application for membership of the EU, which will then be submitted to the European Council.
“Receiving the questionnaire marks yet another step by Iceland on its journey towards full EU membership”, the Prime Minister said. “Iceland is already an active participant in European cooperation as a full member of the EU´s Single Market and the Schengen Agreement, and a founding member of NATO and the OSCE. We are well prepared and believe we will be able to submit our answers to the EU within a reasonably short time,” she added.
The questionnaire includes 2,000 questions in 33 chapters. Individual ministries and governmental institutions will now start preparing answers to the questionnaire, which the Icelandic authorities hope will be concluded in the coming months.
I believe that Iceland’s journey towards full EU membership is few steps closer to reality. I think the country deserves full membership to the EU and they too deserve to exercise the befefits and privileges that other members enjoy.
“Most of UK debt is in GDP”
I mean GBP, Pounds sterling.
Vilhjalm Antonsen said:
“I think the problem for UK is that a lot of the debt is in foreign currency and cannot be easily printed away, as in the USA or Italy or Japan. Plus UK has poor industry and resources (and bloated civil service and finance sectors), nothing much to drive the economy.”
Most of UK debt is in GDP.
Industry may have shrunk but the UK is in the top 5 exporters and the bloated finance sector was a big money earner.
The UK makes just about every type of product that is made in the West and it may not have much oil and gas, but it has a hell of lot more than most countries such as Germany and France.
>Why stop there – Scotland too!
Don’t suppose they’ll take their banks back, do you? :)
all that is required is a lawsuit judgment and a naval blockade with a few ships, and the energy is all theirs!
The only thing stopping that for the US is that the rest of the world would see them for the sh*t bags they really are and the US public would protest,
this has crossed my mind though.
“Why stop there – Scotland too!”
Royal bank of Scotland, Darling, Brown…..
if something good comes from Scotland besides Whiskey i haven’t seen it.
>Soon it be time to cut Northern Ireland out of the UK and save yourselves £5bn/pa.
Why stop there – Scotland too!
“Still, £20k-30k per citizen would still be horrific. Anyone know what the comparible figure for Iceland is assuming that the Icesave guarantee is paid in full and a 75% recovery on Landsbanki?”
No one knows how much we will end up paying, the numbers change from day to day, the IMF loan will probably be canceled, its not coming anyway, some Japanese investors want to invest $ 1bn in banking or energy, Norwegian and Chinese investors are also interested, as long as they are honest people and not connected to the EU in any way they are ok by me, Chinalco the largest Aluminum producer in China will send people next weekend to look at a possible building site.
Look at this slideshow
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8249411.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/business/2007/creditcrunch/default.stm
the basic reasons for the trouble Britain is in are the same as here, corruption, poor regulation, greed and dishonesty of the politicians and the people who own them.
UK debt will be closer to Eur45k per citizen. No escaping that, no matter how much you might wish to water it down.
Soon it be time to cut Northern Ireland out of the UK and save yourselves £5bn/pa.
Atm in Ireland, its about Eur35k per citizen and a plan in parliament to double the national debt will increase that to 65k/per citizen.
I forget what the Icesave liability alone comes to, around EUR30k per person?
As I said before, I make no presumption about what the icelanders will choose to do. It is neither my wish nor my job to endear the EU to the Icelandic nation. You either like us and what we stand for and want to join or you don’t, its that simple. 500 million EU citizens and their multinational union are not going to get too uppset or worked up about what a small 3rd party island nation of the middle of the atlantic thinks about them or what it decides to do. We certainly aren’t going to strain ourselves to impress you or care too much about what you think about us.
Were you a member state that would be completely different. I care very much what the Maltese think. They are fellow citizens, as precious to me as your fellow islanders are to you. There are many policies in the EU where unanimity is required, where the whole of the EU waits with baited breath for what 300000 Maltese decide to do. That is the nature of our union it gives disproportionate power to small nations.
You may well reject the EU in referendum and if so that is little skin off my and every other Eu citizens nose. Iceland is a European (or at least I see it as such) nation and so by EU law has a right to apply for membership, but is under no obligation to join. This will one day change no doubt. At some point the EU members will probably decide that enough is enough and change the treaties and do away with the post of enlargement comissioner and enlargement will cease. No polity ever expands indefinitely. If at that time Iceland, Norway, etc are on the outside of the tent ******* in rather than on the inside ******* out then that was your choice and you will have to live with it.
As the EU’s collective foreign and security policy developes I dare say that the various differentiations the EU makes between 3rd party countries will become less and less nuanced. EFTA, EEA, etc coutries will probably be viewed more and more as just foreign countries and less and less as fellow european travlers. In the end that will mean that your country will be sandwiched between two superpowers, utterly dependent upon their goodwill and utterly powerless to influence their policies.
In a world of giants true independence and sovriegnity comes from having some control over at least one of those giants. Eu membership offers a great deal of power for small countries (remember the EU’s political system is disproportionatly weighted in their favour and then there are the vetos). Of course, that power to control the world around you to persue your interests comes at a cost of not being able to decide everything for yourselves, but then in a world of giants small isolated countries don’t really enjoy that luxury in any case. Witness Icesave.
“I don’t know enough about it either but according to the Office for National Statistics the UK national debt is £2.5tn, or will be in months, budget deficit of £175m.If national debt were some sort of slide rule, the UK debt is well up there.”
If USA is 5-6 times bigger than UK, the Uk’s national debt is right up there with the USA, which has something like 11 trillion of liability / national debt. The UK budget deficit is similar to USA too.
I think the problem for UK is that a lot of the debt is in foreign currency and cannot be easily printed away, as in the USA or Italy or Japan. Plus UK has poor industry and resources (and bloated civil service and finance sectors), nothing much to drive the economy. So the solution for UK must be domestic budget cuts for the yearly budget deficit and most of all printing money, devaluation, and deflation, which really amounts to taking all the possessions of everyone in the UK and cutting them by 30-40%.
It does not matter much for geopolitics if the English people become poor, it only matters that the “City”, the finance center remains powerful. For this reason the USA may intervene and help their partner. This new intervention could be a unified UK-US currency, profitable war in Iran, seizing oilfields in southern Iraq, or something smaller – such as nationalizing the energy of Iceland and giving it to UK. Think about it , the UK is facing serious energy shortages and blackouts by 2015, and Iceland is small, desperate, poor, friendless and defenseless, all that is required is a lawsuit judgment and a naval blockade with a few ships, and the energy is all theirs!
In the larger scheme the 20-30 billion pounds value of Iceland is not that much but it will provide energy independence and an economic stimulus.
Not sure about the £2.5tn.
This Daily Express article seems to explain the situation:
http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/money/view/125402
So some, although not all, of that extra £1.5tn is recoverable.
Still, £20k-30k per citizen would still be horrific. Anyone know what the comparible figure for Iceland is assuming that the Icesave guarantee is paid in full and a 75% recovery on Landsbanki?
The size of the UK’s national debt isn’t the real problem: it’s whether that debt is manageable. Both Conservative and Labour have said there will be tax rises and service cuts after the next election. And that’s why the rating agencies’ latest reports conclude the debt is manageable. Once the election is over, the pain will start and the debt will reduce. As sure as night follows day…
On Sep 11, 2009, Bromley86 said:
“Sorry Fisy, don’t know enough about it.
Is the UK in a bad situation? Yes. Is it worse than Iceland’s? No. Even according to that article, it’s not as bad are Ireland’s.”
—————————————————-
I don’t know enough about it either but according to the Office for National Statistics the UK national debt is £2.5tn, or will be in months.
Is that about £40,000 for every UK citizen?
budget deficit of £175m
If national debt were some sort of slide rule, the UK debt is well up there.
The UK must have about the largest government deficit in percentage of GDP in the European Union.
Yes, there’s little chance of Brown winning next year’s general election. The bookies give Labour’s chances at around 6/1:
http://www.oddschecker.com/specials/politics-and-election/next-uk-general-election/most-seats
Axel said:
“What if Brown by some miracle manages to stay in office, people forget quicly,”
By the same miracle Angels will descend to earth and give us billions of pounds to pay off our debts.
It won’t happen of course, Browns problem is his inability to lead. He disappears when there is trouble. Labour lurch from mistake to mistake typical of a party who have lost touch with reality. Their latest farce is to suggest that everyone who has contact with children has to have police checks. Thats a real vote winner, criminalise half the population to ‘protect’ them.
No, Labour is history – its time for a change.
They have now started to talk about cuts, its slowly dawned on them that *nobody* believes that Labour will not be cutting after the election.
“Looking at the Telegraph report.. well yes, the next government has to cut spending and increase taxes.
“Everybody knows that, especially the markets which is why they are waiting until next year (A general election must be held by no later than Thursday 3 June 2010).
Given the UK’s stable exchange rate and general lack of new surprises there is no chance that the IMF will be called in before then. When the Conservatives get in it will be Tax and cut for 10-20 years, just like last time.”
What if Brown by some miracle manages to stay in office, people forget quicly,
Brown is a slippery fellow and has been both hated and loved over the last few months.
mostly hated though, and for good reasons.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOHpbjefRIE
@Axel. Context? You have a point I presume?
Your biggest problem is not the terrible state of the economy in Britain, its the inability to stop Brown and co from ruining your country,
no one ever questions anything, the Irish get to vote on the Lisbon treaty, in UK it will be ratified and you will not hear the smallest whisper about it,
When we finish sorting out our own mess we may have to invade Britain to restore democracy :)
Axel,
“Thinking out of the box ( a good thing that Icelanders do not seem very good at).
It also applies to you, dont’you think?”
Prossibly, i hope not, Icelanders where in a box in a sense, for example we were fed lies from the media about the amazing victorys of the Viking busynesmen, like Jón Ásgeir Jóhannesson, by media owned by Jón Ásgeir Jóhannesson, those people grew so rich and powerfull no one could stand in their way, incl the Central bank and Icelandic FSA,
when they own or control everything in the country incl the government there is not much the public can actually do anyway, when the whole thing fell apart it was a massive shock to the nation, the biggest problem was not in the finacial sector but corruption in politics, if we manage to eliminate that we can repair the economy, if we fail to do that we will just see the same thing happen again, only getting poorer and more enslaved every time,
why should we believe things are any different in UK or EU, i wonder what would float up if UK would crash like Iceland did,
i think people should look at what happened here and learn from it, what seems to be ok on the surface may be so rotten and damaged that it is held together by some thin web of lies fed to you by the media and trough people in the finacial sector, like analysts or grading companys.
I would bet that the social SD LG gov will not live to finish negotiating with EU, they have 3-4 months to live at best, no matter how fast the EU tryes to pull Iceland in its just not going to happen, Jóhanna, Össur and Björk want to join, everyone else is staying out.
>So do make sure that you use this knoweldge in your big argumenting over at Telegraph. That will be intellectual honest argumenting.
Yeah, right. Pot, kettle.
Look Fisy, you can dress it up any way you want, but both of us know that the application to join the EU does not mean that Iceland will join the EU if its people dont want to. Any other position is either (a) deluded or (b) that intellectual dishonesty you mention.
But never forget that we’re on the same side here; I don’t want Iceland in the EU either. It’s just that I believe people should make the choices that they are allowed and entitled to make from a position of knowledge rather than fear, even if that increases the chance of a result that I do not favour. Can you say the same?
@Axel. Context? You have a point I presume?
Axel,
Thinking out of the box ( a good thing that Icelanders do not seem very good at).
It also applies to you, dont’you think?
Peter and Bromley, you are eventually going to have to start thinking more “outside the box”
Brumley
>Whilst I see what you’re trying to do, it is an unnecessary manipulation and one that can be quite dangerous. Statistically anyway.
I am quoting other who made that.
Important one is of course the fundemental result of this poll:
“Latest polls Capacent Gallup show that 48.5 percent are opposed to EU membership and 34.7 percent are in favour. 16.7 percent remain undecided.”
You do understand though what I am explaining there above how it is in how this polls are — that there are the three different questions each which have different reaction of Icelander taking the poll.
Polls asking if people wanted to start membership talks (aðildarviðræður) with the EU have almost always resulted in a majority in favour and is always one you see plaster on front of Fréttablaðið as ” proof ” Icelander want EU.
But because people ( including you in other post Brumley )do not understnad that you have to apply * before * the EU will have talks and talk about any deal.
There are no just ” talks ” to ” find out ” what the deal might be. You have to apply to find out the deal.
And that — applying to join EU — Icelander are consistently * against *. And more so when details of EU are discussed.
So do make sure that you use this knoweldge in your big argumenting over at Telegraph. That will be intellectual honest argumenting.
Fisy:
I long ago stopped reading your rants and insults.
Looking at the Telegraph report.. well yes, the next government has to cut spending and increase taxes.
Everybody knows that, especially the markets which is why they are waiting until next year (A general election must be held by no later than Thursday 3 June 2010).
Given the UK’s stable exchange rate and general lack of new surprises there is no chance that the IMF will be called in before then. When the Conservatives get in it will be Tax and cut for 10-20 years, just like last time.
Sorry Fisy, don’t know enough about it.
Is the UK in a bad situation? Yes. Is it worse than Iceland’s? No. Even according to that article, it’s not as bad are Ireland’s.
Not that that’s anything to crow about. It certainly might go some way to explaining why Iceland has been forced to accept a market-rate rather than a friend-rate on the Icesave loans (should they go ahead :) ).
>The likelihood of the UK approaching the IMF are pretty slim.
Clueless as ever Peter – London..
Here are some facts for Brumley86 to comment on. If the EU commission is complaining about this.. then the situation is bad bad.
“The [EU] Commission fears Britain will suffer lasting damage as result of the financial crisis and the bursting of the property bubble. Neither banking nor construction will recover quickly, relegating the country to a lower growth trajectory.
Brussels warned Britain before the onset of the crisis that public spending was out of hand, repeatedly reminding Gordon Brown that the credit boom was masking the true scale of the problem. The UK ran deficits of 3pc of GDP at the top of the cycle, while Spain was running a surplus of 2pc. Britain was the only major country to face the EU’s excessive deficit procedure in 2007, even before recession played havoc with state finances.
Stephen Lewis, chief strategist at Monument Securities, said that once public debt goes much above 100pc of GDP it becomes hard to reverse. “The debt snowballs because interest costs alone push up the deficit, so you can race up to 180pc very fast.”
Attempts to bring the debt down by a spending squeeze can prove counter-productive because lack of growth itself drives the deficit higher. “Once you get there your trapped,” he said.
Britain’s debt briefly touched 252pc of GDP after World War Two, but the circumstances were then entirely different. War-time spending could be slashed instantly and the demographic balance of young and old was still positive.
Debt anywhere near 180pc of GDP today would test the UK Gilt market to destruction. While Japan is still able to fund an even higher level of debt without paying exorbitant rates, it is does not depend on foreigners to cover the bond auctions.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/recession/6169544/European-Commission-sees-galloping-UK-debt-crisis.html
Forget the messengers, analyse the facts please.
>Measuring those in favour or against on own from above 58.3 percent oppose EU membership while 41.7 percent favour the step.
I had a big argument with some Icelanders over on the Telegraph about this 58.3% figure. Whilst I see what you’re trying to do, it is an unnecessary manipulation and one that can be quite dangerous. Statistically anyway.
49% against should be a good enough statement for the anti-EU camp as it is. Mind you, IIRC only 30% would say no to the EU whatever offer was on the table.
In Sep 9, 2009, O. L. said:
>
>Dear Olli,
>
>As you will know by now the eurosceptics who currently sit in the opposition
>chairs do not speak for us.
I think you really did not like the truth I spoke there did you.
See also my above post with some little fact that you would like ignore:
https://www.icenews.is/index.php/2009/09/08/commissioner-rehn-presents-eu-questionnaire-to-icelandic-pm/comment-page-1/#comment-93117
George writes :
>Whether Iceland wants to join under the terms you reach with the EU during the
>negotiations is up to Icelanders to decide, but it is a bit presumptuous of you to
>speak for all icelanders, or even a majority of them, when those terms have not
>yet been agreed.
Iceland is the Icelandic nation, the individuals and families.
How nice of you to mention us people the voters and tax payers. Not politicians in Social Democrat and Left Green that want to squander our future tax payer money by saying yes to IceSave deal without amendments and without consent of people who will pay for it.
As much as Jóhanna and other 1970s left winger in her EU at any cost party would love to be part of EU club with it nice expenses and the nice comfy office in Berlaymonster or in Strasborg they are worthless politician who have not lived in real world earning real living for decades.
This government coalition now is not representative of that nation in any way close to majority because we were not asked if we wanted to start member negotiation and last election in April was not about the EU. It was about punish the Independence Party.
Despite incredible shock of banks situation since Lehman brothers fell felt still in time of April election still Social Democrat did not increase they vote by much. Instead the 10% big swing in votes that changed hands did go from anti-EU independence party to anti-EU ( or so Steingrímur J. claims ) Left Greens.
( I say claims because he seem to love power more than his principles. But still his supporter they are almost without any exception anti-EU. the ones that give him his delegated power as MP and paerty leader.
But can you be sure that the new 10% supporter have left him already because his lack of principals. Now those votes, they are not gone to Social Democrats. )
And I can tell you that despite this 10% drop still Independence Party is still the second largest party in parliment after Social Democrats. And where do you think that 10% votes are going now after the huge disapointm net of Steingrímur to his supporter?
>Imagine that the EU allows Iceland to retain its fishing rights
That takes a large enough imagination.
Other nations will not go for that.They large fishing fleets such as Spain need access to new not overfished waters of which left is Iceland.
But EU member ship will not be just that issue. We will have 0.4% voting power in EU or less depending on new members that might join after us and we will have all costs of implementing from our 7% or so of EU regulation we have now to 100%.
You have got to be kidding if you think this EU member ship idea will be about fishing,
In history and this is the way it is with polls :
Polls asking if people wanted to start membership talks (aðildarviðræður) with the EU have almost always resulted in a majority in favour.
Polls asking if people wanted to apply for membership (umsókn um aðild) of the EU have almost always resulted in a majority against.
Polls asking if people wanted to join the EU have usually resulted in a 50/50 situation.
As soon as issue of joining is discussed in media opinion polls of yes always go down. More Icelandic people here about how EU works less they want to be a part.
Latest polls Capacent Gallup show that 48.5 percent are opposed to EU membership and 34.7 percent are in favour. 16.7 percent remain undecided.
Measuring those in favour or against on own from above 58.3 percent oppose EU membership while 41.7 percent favour the step.
No side has gained 10% since beginning of May last polls taken. And Yes side has lost over 4%.
>and skews things so
>that you are net beneficiaries of the budget in order to help you pay off your
>icesave debts and even offers you an accelerated path to the euro. Under those
>conditions I am not so sure that Icelander’s would say no.
We are not beggars, even though EU regulation did try its best to make us into ones. And as did UK and Holland negotiatior over IceSave.
We will pay these debts ourself from our own resources I can assure you.
>The EU can afford to be generous to Iceland, you are a small country and we are a
>big powerful and rich union
I wont go much further in disenbouling you post further as you so clearly do not understand the Icelandic mentality there is no points.
If you want to understand it better in single way you go and read European Commission public opinion analysis that was done. One were 85% of Icelanders found independence to be “very important” contrasted with the EU25 average of 53%.
You writing is not the way to endear EU commission to Icelander.
“The last country before Iceland to recive a IMF loan was UK, they seem to likely to ask for another one soon,”
Err, no. The UK received its loan in 1976, it was the last WESTERN country to get one. Many other countries have received loans since then.
I don’t see the logic of your claim that the UK will need another loan because it took one 33 years ago.
In fact, the UK has a major advantage over many countries, the GBP is a reserve currency making up 5% of currency reserves. The BRIC nations are also moving away from the Dollar and buying IMF SDR’s which are 11% GBP.
The likelihood of the UK approaching the IMF are pretty slim.
The questions are posted here:
http://www.mfa.is/speeches-and-articles/nr/5075
>does not change the fact that UK is in the sh** , deeper than Iceland.
This seems highly unlikely. Any source?
I think Fisy has right, EU isn’t a worthwhile choice ;) He posted how to raise Icelander heads up (just use google or the internal search form). Nice said.
Greetings from the worst EU country so far.
Fisy – If Iceland doesn’t join the EU and adopt the euro, then how is it going to solve the problem of its small currency? Unilaterally adopt another currency, such as the USD?…
O. L. said
“Yes that was an IMF loan we’ve received, although we don’t consider oursleves a third world country.”
The last country before Iceland to recive a IMF loan was UK, they seem to likely to ask for another one soon,
green sprouts will probably emerge soon, elections coming soon and all that, does not change the fact that UK is in the sh** , deeper than Iceland.
More EU countryes are in trouble as well, Finland and Sweeden for example.
He did – it’s at the end 94/19/EC (deposit guarantees).
Dear Olli,
As you will know by now the eurosceptics who currently sit in the opposition chairs do not speak for us.
We are ready to join the EU.
We can afford to join the EU.
We want to join the EU.
The European Union has never asked us to join, it is us and us alone who have now decided to apply.
It has always been this way for all countries that have joined or wish to join.
And the direction things are going outside of the EU, it is clear that we, as well as the Faroe and other nations, are more likely to join than any member is to leave.
Our regards
– People of Iceland
PS. The credit crisis, our volatile currency, and our inability to access EU emergency funds have had a tremendous cost for all Icelanders and will continue to do so over the next years, so let the grumpies stick their isolationist ideas back into their peep holes where they came from.
Yes that was an IMF loan we’ve received, although we don’t consider oursleves a third world country.
Fisy
Unless you tell us which regulation we are hardly likely to believe you. I can’t think of a single regulation that would cost that much, unless you are talking about the fee you pay for access to the single market being a non-EU member. EU members get such access for free by the way. They also get structural and agricultural funds. Who knows, if you negotiate right, get the EU to factor in your Icesave repayments against your GDP, you will probably spend the first 15 years in the EU as net beneficiaries of the budget, making it easier for you to pay off your debts to two of our members.
Whether Iceland wants to join under the terms you reach with the EU during the negotiations is up to Icelanders to decide, but it is a bit presumptuous of you to speak for all icelanders, or even a majority of them, when those terms have not yet been agreed.
Imagine that the EU allows Iceland to retain its fishing rights and skews things so that you are net beneficiaries of the budget in order to help you pay off your icesave debts and even offers you an accelerated path to the euro. Under those conditions I am not so sure that Icelander’s would say no.
The EU can afford to be generous to Iceland, you are a small country and we are a big powerful and rich union. If it weren’t for the principle of the thing the icesave debts could be paid off from the EU budget (1% of EU GDP) by money that states have failed to claim, i.e. spare change that has fallen down the back of the couch.
I’m not saying that the Icelander’s can be bought-I’m sure they will weigh how generous the EU is off other factors-but I seriously doubt that the EU will be unable to table an offer to Iceland that is at least tempting for the average Icelander.
Dear Olli,
As you will know by now the people who currently sit in the government chairs do not speak for us.
We are not ready to join the EU.
We can’t afford to join the EU.
We don’t want to join the EU.
It doesn’t matter how many times you ask us, like the Irish with Lisbon, the answer is no.
It has always been no.
And the direction things are going in the EU, it is clear the UK is more likely to rejoin us in EFTA than we are to join the EU.
Our regards
— People of Iceland
PS. Please stick your EU regulations back into the peep holes of the bureaucrats where they came from.
One of those regulations+ alone is going to cost us tax payers 2 billion Euros and more over the next years.
Yes that was just from one EU regulation.
..
+94/19/EC.
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